Check this – air return and combustion air. A rusted area on a vent pipe not only lets rainwater enter the attic but also allows potentially dangerous downdrafts to push fumes into the home's living space. I’m pretty sure you’re aware how dangerous Carbon Monoxide can be…. According to the instructions this condition indicates a lack of combustion air and will produce excess soot. Both connections start above the bottom of the pipe, and the problem I have is that the bottom is not capped. Then, hold an extinguished match near the vent hood. Gas service company rep said (on phone) “water leaks from vents” indicate chimney problem. Check the gas water heater vent pipe clearances post for more about natural draft water heater venting. Run double wall pipe or two single wall pipes through the holes, install proper flashing, and termination connectors just like on the Rheem manual pages. Compared to atmospheric, direct-vent water heaters offer more installation flexibility because they can vent horizontally. Two PVC pipes connected through the wall provide combustion air and exhaust venting for the new furnace. Sign In to view purchased products. old. Watch out: Before connecting a vent to a chimney, make sure the chimney passageway is clear and free of obstructions. If / when this is delayed, the WH’s igniter timing is off, there’s too much gas accumulated inside the burner chamber and when it finally ignites it creates that small explosion. You can also explore Repair Clinic’s DIY content library to watch videos and read articles concerning common problems affecting water heaters, how to test certain components, and how to install new parts. There are two other chimney ports for fireplaces, how can I direct the intake away from exhaust from the other ports (1 unused but functional wood fireplace in the middle and 1 seldom used natural gas fireplace on the other side)? To fully understand house natural gas water heater venting I highly recommend reading House Brick Chimney Problems & Gas Water Heater and Furnace Chimney Flue Sizing posts – several of the water heater vent pipe conditions described below depend on properly operating and installed chimney! Shop Grainger for rugged gas pipe fittings. The venting pipe needs to be completely sealed where it passes through a wall or into the chimney to prevent air leaks. Examine the location to ensure the water heater complies with the “Locating the New Water Heater” section in this manual. Gas water heater draft hoods come in different sizes, and if you are replacing water heater, make sure, that the draft hood and the water heater vent pipe match each other. The water heater itself doesn’t really smell unless there’s something that has fallen into or through the chimney flue and is burning inside it. Is the utility closet equipped with a sufficient amount of combustion air providing vents – louver doors, ventilation ports between its interior and the rest of the house, exterior of the house (check combustion air article). Once again, thanks for your attention! If the draft hood is in good shape, you may be able to reuse it with the new water heater. Immediately to the left of the WH is the washer then the dryer to the far left. Installation and service must be performed by a qualified installer, service agency or the gas supplier. During high winds the pilot light goes out. The connection between the draft hood and the vent pipe should be secured with sheet metal screws – three per connection on a single wall pipe are recommended. Your crawlspace is not a conditioned space (you do not control temperature and humidity in there?) Please help. I’ve finally found what I was looking for about chimney caps! I am in the process of purchasing a new hgh efficiency furnace. 1) Get chimney inspection. As far as sealing goes, someone gave me some firecaulk. Always follow the appliance manufacturer’s recommendations and comply with your local code requirements – again – never downsize the water heater vent pipe! My situation is similar to your pic, except that mine is all sheet metal. I have a vent pipe that handles both the hot water heater and the furnace. If your HVAC system creates a back-draft there might be a “leak” in the air supplying ducts. What Do You Need to Know About Trenchless Pipe Lining? 1. The heat exchanger of a forced air furnace installed in a crawlspace has a tendency to deteriorate much faster due to excessive humidity and temperature variations. But now it’s perfect thanks to this video. This is a dedicated vent pipe for the WH only. You’re very kind Tony :-), thank you… The “white stuff” (most likely) on the vent pipes is a result of ventilation problems / possibly clogged chimney. 3. Rheem. The back draft insert prevents air from entering the top of the water heater and improves heat distribution in the tank. Rheem Adjustable Vent Length 3 x 5 in. Some building inspectors don’t even allow aluminum tape on joints. Occasionally, there might be some condensation developing inside the vent pipe and if you seal the cap on the bottom, it will just result in corrosion. Search within results … We've got millions of parts, hundreds of brands, and thousands of step-by-step videos— everything you need to find it, fix it and finish the job right. Small holes start appearing on their surface – most common areas are along the bottom portion and on connectors. In order to do this, two critical measurements must be taken: one on the ceiling above the water heater and one that is the distance from the attic floor to the roof. This ensures the water heater can heat the vent pipe enough to get exhaust gasses to rise out of the house. Please give me your advice, thanks. You can go over to the manufacturer’s website or simply give them a call and ask about your particular model. When installing the Rinnai direct vent water heaters, use Rinnai vent/air intake system kits and components only. Get some estimates for each option. Because of a sealed combustion I wouldn’t try any repairs by yourself. Thinking about relocating your natural draft gas water heater to the garage area? It’s a magnesium or aluminum that is wrapped around a steel core wire rod, screwed in into the WH top plate that prevents corrosion of your tank. 1. new electric water heater / remove old chimney / you have to run 220V power line to the water heater’s location. It sits on 3-4 short legs, sometimes secured to the water heater top plate with screws, or (depending on design) has its legs shaped like pins or hooks at the end, inserted into the holes in water heater top cover. Over the years it corrodes, deteriorates and sometimes falls in pieces onto the burner, which might cause problems, compromise combustion, and result in CO poisoning. A water heater using atmospheric venting or direct venting will allow the fumes to exhaust naturally by rising straight up through a vertical vent which is routed to the home’s chimney, or through an upward sloping vent which may be routed through the chimney or through a wall to the home’s exterior. Your newer water heater is equipped with a safety device (read my answer to Christa’s question below) which shuts off the burner / pilot whenever it senses inadequate amount of combustion air or a downdraft (created by your HVAC system). Currently both the furnace and hot water heater are vented into an exterior brick chimney. But if you're up for the challenge, you can save yourself some money by doing it yourself, follow the instructions … The new water heater has a sealed combustion chamber with a screened combustion air intake around the bottom. However, you have to make sure that it’s sealed properly, you can use high temperature caulking (if permitted for such applications in your area), or seal the penetration around the pipe with mortar. My question is ….. Is this a water heater issue or HVAC or chimney issue? residential gas water heaters installation and operating manual 1410 328767-001 keep this manual in the pocket on heater for future reference whenever maintenance adjustment or service is required. Maybe an open air duct in the attic, crawlspace (don’t have enough info on your entire system). Is the utility closet equipped with a sufficient amount of combustion air providing vents – louver doors, ventilation ports between its interior and the rest of the house, exterior of the house (check combustion air article) 2. Correct combustion, vent action, and vent pipe installation are very important in preventing death from possible carbon monoxide poisoning and fi res (see Figure 14 & Figure 15). Natural draft gas water heater, 14 years old, vent sizes (from hood) 4″ into 6″, ~8′ into chimney. Smaller diameter double wall to double wall vent pipe sections utilize twist lock fittings with no screws / larger diameter B-vent pipes might require screws on its joints. Chimney inspection ASAP, they will tell you what needs to be done. In this configuration however, the chimney section inside the house and within the attic would have to be repaired, tuckpointed, sealed, closed-off properly around the B-Vent to flex liner connection (so the connection remains within the chimney walls). Start doing it yourself with the confidence that comes with 100+ years of experience. With direct vent installations, there is a sealed combustion chamber and a flue pipe. To check the venting on your existing unit, close all windows and doors and turn on all gas appliances and exhaust fans and turn up the temperature on your water heater for a few minutes. The common rule is that the horizontal part of the single wall vent pipe must be equal or shorter than 75% of it’s total developed height. I asked the contractor to check any venting problem, like draft hood, pipe, cap, etc. Gas Residential – Low NOx Emissions. In your case it would be 4.5″ or more (the closest you can get is 5″). Make the vent pipe section between the water heater and the chimney as short and as straight as possible. Natural draft gas water heater vent pipe system is still dominating and as long as the property has favorable structural conditions and a chimney dedicated for use with gas burning appliances, you can use this type of venting. The furnace installer is telling me since the furnace will be vented out the wall, there will not be enough draw for the hot water tank to be safely vented up the chimney. The flue is the venting that the fumes travel through to be safely exhausted outside of the home. The dryer has its own dedicated vent pipe to the side of the bldg. per foot of pipe. Just to clarify my comments earlier regarding the “explosion at the end of the cycle.” That doesn’t happen. WH gas regulators are designed for dealing with the amount of gas provided from the gas meter / pressure regulator / gas piping. The blower pushes the exhaust and excess heat through the exhaust venting. However, the biggest problem that I can see is the proximity of the other two chimney flues. Keep the leg that connects to the union so you can re-use them later. Can you recommend a fix for me? Once these measurements are recorded, you are ready to begin. For this reason, water heaters with a power vent should not be installed in small, enclosed spaces. Type B gas vent pipe has a smaller pipe inside a larger pipe (also know as double wall pipe) for insulation and safety. Thank you. all technical and warranty questions: should be directed to … Let me know if this answered your question. I was absolutely clueless, I had ours all wrong. If your water heater relies on atmospheric or direct venting, you will need to use UL listed Type B metal flue piping that is three or four inches in diameter. To make a long story short, we’ve come to find out the drain (previously used only as the “emergency” drain from the drip-pan) cannot accommodate a continuous flow of water, mainly condensation from the Ultra High Efficiency unit, because it terminates outside and it freezes up every night. Along one of the 4′ sides, there is also another 8″ x 16″ vent. After I read through your web-side. On any horizontal sections of vent, make sure the pipe slopes down toward the water heater 1/4 in. The 2nd water heater will be the same, but i want to use the same vent pipe for both. Power venting water heaters are considered more energy-efficient than a standard direct vent system and are more effective at preventing back draft air from entering the water heater. As long as the pilot is stable, the burner ignites ok, and the flame looks good do you think it is OK to operate this way until the chimney flue can be properly sized? You’d need Gama Vent Tables to perform those calculations ask ask your local building department / licensed plumbing contractor to evaluate your installation. It stops about 6 inches from the roof. My uncle had all this installed my husband is wondering abt the height the pipe/ flute needs to be above roof . The vent piping is unchanged from the old unit. Without using vent pipe tables for your particular installation and just applying general rules, you can use 45° connectors and one 60° connector. Then everything seemed ok. Once the burner stopped burning and someone turned on the hot water, the small explosion by the draft hood would happen again. Selected location must provide adequate clearances for servicing and proper operation of the water heater. I have a nautual draft water heater can i change it to a induced draft by just adding a motor or is there something I ned to do ? Any tips on supporting the pipes vertically inside the chimney (the manual states vertical supports every 4′). In fact, advances in unit design have made the installation of energy-efficient tankless water heaters less expensive, more attractive, and easier to fit within your home plan, all while saving space. Anode rods usually last 5 -6 years, which depends mostly on the quality of your water and how much of that water are you using. In addition, could the Water heater be defective, (still under warranty)? Such installation could create pyrophoric conditions and a fire-hazard. 1. You’d have to consult this second option with a local building department (HVAC division) or / and HVAC contractor. The equipment and vents are located in a crawlspace that is humid in summer and is very dry in the winter, but the temperature never falls below 50 F. Noticed water dripping and peak CO readings from two (Kidde Nighthawk) detectors increasing slightly since Feb 2011, CO/Gas detector went off May 14, 2011. In both cases, the water heater needs to be located near an exterior wall or a chimney for the venting system to work properly. The bi-product of incomplete combustion is carbon monoxide… Ask your HVAC guy about providing calculating sufficient combustion air supply for them. / DON’T install reducing connector from 4″ draft hood to 3″ water heater vent pipe just to accommodate an old venting system. If the discharge pipe is not connected to a drain or other suitable means, the water flow may cause prop- erty damage. Some installation might be a significant challenge, or even become impossible, due to a water heater height and chimney flue connection level, in those cases, induced draft motor equipped water heater should be considered. Let me know if you have any other questions, Thanks. Missing chimney’s rain cap worsens the situation by allowing rain water penetration and causing interior wall surface and joints deterioration. Because the power vent uses a fan motor to draw the exhaust fumes through the flue, the venting can be longer and more horizontal which will give you more location options for installing the water heater. If you have any specific questions concerning your warranty, please consult the plumbing … 2) Inspect vents and/or replace due to age? Hi Brian, A picture would be helpful, but I believe it is something like on the one here. Good luck with your project! The draft hood is usually connected to the vent pipe with three or four sheet metal screws. Let me know if you need some help with it. Thanks for the quick reply!!! It might be the gas valve which is malfunctioning resulting in an erratic opening and closing. Do you know why a builder would not provide a bottom cap? The Discharge Pipe: –Must not be smaller in size than the outlet pipe size of the valve, or have any reducing couplings or other restriction. Do you think I still need more “vent?”, I will call manufacturer while waiting for your response : ). You are welcome Jay, any home maintenance questions – just let me know. UNTIL the next user turn on the hot water AGAIN, the cycle repeats like clockwork. The WH vent pipe / chimney drafting problems could be a result of the weather, combustion air problems inside your house, your house being too tight, some obstruction inside the chimney flue, oversized chimney, undersized chimney… So, without all those questions answered I can’t tell you what’s responsible for the melting, but it isn’t normal. They contain slightly acidic water vapor which (with obstructed chimney) condensates on the chimney’s interior walls and flows back down through the metal pipes reacting with galvanized metal (zinc). maybe just laziness? You have a few options on the drawing. Should gas water heaters be raised off of the floor? Run a flexible liner inside the chimney to the point of termination inside the attic, connect a B-Vent to the liner and continue this double wall pipe through the roof. You should be able to purchase a cap designed for this purpose, they come in various diameters. There’s a 1” difference in the max. What are the requirements for power venting? With the gas shutoff, it’s a good thing the heating season is over so we’ll only have to do without hot water until I can get the chimney/gas appliance companies in. (60 cm) Max. There should be a minimum of 12 inches of vertical venting between the draft hood outlet and the first elbow or connecter. all … Also known as the Type B, this vent is operating on the natural air convection. For natural draft type just use galvanized steel pipe and don’t experiment with aluminum pipes, food cans with removed both ends, stainless steel sections, blue stove pipes, high temperature plastic tubing, flexible pipes…, etc. Otherwise, I’d look for some other source of that odor, a floor drain, open sewer line, sump / ejector pump well, etc. Okay, thanks. Chimney’s minimum height above the roof will depend on its positioning / location at the penetration point, distance to any structure, roof slope, etc. The water heater is in my bathroom (12.5′x7.5′) on an outside wall and sits on a concrete slab foundation. Ambient Temperature Two ambients must be considered. Hi, I replaced my 10 years old water heater one year ago because I smelled some kind of metal-stink after every re-boil cycle. However, you‘d have to run a B-Vent (double wall pipe) from the point where the water heater vent pipe penetrates the chimney wall, through the attic and above the roof. Hello Jody, If it is a natural vent type water heater you can not vent it through the side wall, it has to vent above the roof. Get a licensed HVAC contractor, visit your local building department and find out who has approved such installation. Smith, Bradford White, Richmond, or Whirlpool. The easiest way would be to put a metal cap on the top of the chimney opening with one or two holes in it (depending on which installation you’re going to pick). Our water heater is in the basement and we didn’t know if there is any other way to vent it. I keep the “vent window” closed year-round and run a dehumidfier in the summer, but it’s a lost cause. Page 15: Water … Direct-Vent Water Heaters . There is a return port around the corner none in the closet. Gas company visited today, confirmed CO detection, said vents/chimney were not exhausting properly, deemed installation unsafe, shut off gas. So, because it is rated as combustible, any CPVC pipe must be a minimum of 6 inches away from the draft hood and flue connector at the top of a gas water heater, based on Table 503.1.5 “Clearances for Connectors”, of the Florida Plumbing Code and International Plumbing Code. This heater installation may be unsafe. The height on the front 17′ wide (where the entry door is) is 6′, and the height on the back (where it shares the same wall as the garage) is 7′. The laundry room is 17′ x 4′. I have a gas hot water heater, installed in 2004. Also, well / municipal well water often contains anaerobic bacteria, which reacts with aluminum and magnesium anodes producing hydrogen sulfide gas, thus creating the rotten egg odor… (sodium from softening process makes it worse). The gas should ignite immediately after it’s released from the burner. A direct venting system will pull the intake combustion air from outside the home (through the exhaust venting) whereas a power vent system draws in the room air that surrounds the water heater itself. Last year my old water heater went out, and I bought a brand new one from Home Depot. 4. new tankless water heater / eliminate the chimney / vent through the side wall of the house / you might need larger size gas line for it / the most expensive WH, probably around $2000 installed. It seems if water heater is just on pilot the smell becomes strong. Tankless Water Heater Venting Features. 2. b keep this manual in the pocket on heater for future reference whenever maintenance adjustment or service is required. There are some rust & water stains near the water heater vent hoods. Also, does the intake still have to be 12″ above the chimney level? 2. We just got done replacing our old water heater, and need to replace the vent pipe. While you should always review local building codes to confirm the proper way to install water heater venting, here are some general guidelines to follow: From power vent fan motors and pressure switches to burner assemblies and anode rods, Repair Clinic carries the specific replacement parts that fit your water heater model, including those manufactured by Rheem, A.O. According to the table on page 44 of the manual you can go 24″ above the roof (top of the chimney crown level) without any additional support. With a direct-vent system, air for combustion is drawn from a vent pipe that runs through an exterior wall or the roof. Simply because it hides problems like corrosion or holes developing on surface. –Must not be plugged or blocked. Will i have to increase the vent pipe size to accomadate both? If space restrictions require the water heater to be installed in a utility closet, make sure the closet doors are louvered, or space left at the top and bottom of the doors, to increase air flow. The water heater is vented through the old chimney for a fuel oil furnace which has been replaced with a high efficiency furnace and no longer uses that chimney. You’re welcome Matt, For the supports you can use plumbing pipe support clamps with horizontal rods attached to it and anchored to the chimney side walls. If the job is bigger than you want to tackle, you can always hire a professional plumber. There IS NO second explosion at the end of a cycle. Do I just buy a round piece of metal and caulk it in? Our team of in-house writers led by a retired Illinois home inspector. Pages 44, 45, 46 show the details of the direct vent, condensing type through the roof vent installation. Hi Steven, From your description it appears that your water heater might be experiencing something similar to a puff-back. I was just rambliing around up there the other day and noticed what appears to be a soot/carmel like subtance, both on the underside of the roof and on the blown in insulation that is laying around the vent pipe. This furnace / water heater vent pipe must continue through the roof and terminate above it. Chimney liner is currently required by code so if you’re performing major repairs on your chimney or replacing any of the appliances – it must be installed and appliances connected directly to the liner (rain cap is required too). Water heaters are unpredictable, they can last for a few more years or crack tomorrow. Measure a straight section of new galvanized vent pipe to rise as high as possible before you install the adjustable elbow (the higher the rise, the better the draft). We recently replaced a very drafty sliding glass door with one that is energy star, tightening the house (so much so I often can’t hear my dog barking to be let back in). posts – several of the water heater vent pipe conditions described below depend on properly operating and installed chimney! Check those posts: Combustion Air Combustion Air Condominium (this one refers to Chicago but applies to “everywhere”) and make sure that your water heater has a sufficient amount of air supply from within the house or exterior. The appliance is still under warranty and you should call for the service ASAP. What’s wrong? Just wanted to say thanks for this excellent instruction on venting. Can you advise on the best steps to take so I solve the right problems? When installing a gas water heater, building codes requires that they be ventilated out of the room, through the attic, and out through the roof. Gas water heater vent pipe connector must continuously run upward towards the chimney entrance, rising not less than 1/4″ per linear foot, to provide proper draft. The WH is inside a laundry room (17’x4′) on the back of a detached garage, and it sits on a concrete slab foundation. Let me know if there’s anything else I could help you with…. Calculate the cost of your chimney repair + natural vent type new appliances VS capping the old chimney and using new appliances venting through the side wall of the house with PVC vent pipes. Your information will *never* be shared or sold to a 3rd party. Disconnect the Water Heater Vent (Gas Heaters Only) Disconnect the vent pipe from the draft hood on the top of the heater. I’d rather go with 7” maximum (if possible, keep the liner size closer to the minimum required diameter instead of a max. vent systems are: (1) avoid an excessive number of turns and bends (Figure 5) and (2) maximize rise; minimize run. When it first fired the flame was “soft and blue” as described in the installation manual. The single-wall vent (about 4′) sits on top of the draft hood, and it’s vented straight up thru the roof with a cap. These vent pipe kits include storm collar kits, vent adapters, connectors and elbows. Rheem 3 in. Flame discoloration is in most cases related (like you’ve mentioned) to inadequate amount of combustion air that must be supplied to sustain complete burning, without producing CO (yellow flame does that). Remove any gas piping that is attached to the old water heater’s gas valve. It’s a condition caused by delayed ignition of gas in a combustion chamber. So, is this normal that the rings melt a little bit? How should I terminate the 2 PVC vents atop the chimney? new Powered Direct Vent Series Gas-Fired Water Heater. After about ten minutes of operation the flame was much larger and nearly all yellow. Is this normal, acceptable? As stated earlier, heat loss through the vent pipe walls can take away from the draft force. I have a gas water heater that vents out the chimney. To avoid another PVC exhaust stack in a commonly used area I would much prefer to run the intake and exhaust (separate 3″ PVC vents) up my chimney (30′ or so rise) in the existing, unlined 12″ chimney (previously used for an older furnace + HWH and now only used for soon-to-be-gone leaking HWH). I’m sure you’ve heard this a few times, but your website/information is very useful! Hi Clay, I’ve put up together a little more information about raising the water heater – Gas Water Heater Raised Above the Floor. Just like with your furnace, you need to have proper venting to exhaust the water heater’s toxic fumes to the outside of the home to keep you and your family safe. There might be several variations… some good and some bad of course. Hi Cindy Is your chimney 12″ in diameter with 4″ liner inside? There is more than 12″ clearance in front and on the right side of the WH. It’s easier to run the vent if you install a “power-vented” type of natural gas (or propane) water heater. They also operate more quietly than their power-venting counterparts. It doesn’t have to be caulked, it’s even better to secure it with sheet metal screws only (3-4). … For horizontal installations is should be supported every 3’ – 3 ½” to avoid sagging … When you compare to the typical vent installation of the tank-type water heaters, tankless brings more flexibility and is cheaper, especially with the sidewall installation when remodeling the house. If the draft hood that came with your water heater has a top opening diameter designed for 3″ vent pipe, and you have 4″ vent pipe installed, use an adapter / increaser to join both of them together. 20 years lifespan is typical for a regular environment installation, I’ve seen severely corroded (with holes) heat exchangers in crawlspace furnaces at 10-15 years of age – have the heat exchanger checked! Typical connection of the natural draft gas water heater vent pipe would look more or less like one on the picture (one of the problems with this connection – missing screws at draft hood). If you look inside the pipe and it appears to be clean / no rust, there is most like no draft problems and no worries about exhaust gases backing up into the house. The water heater is 14 yrs. On standard gas water heaters, the fumes are commonly exhausted through a back draft insert and flue. If you have a corbelled chimney (angled) within the attic, assembling a b-vent pipe inside it would not be possible.